Thank you very much for coming to this session. What we’re gonna do today is we are going to go around and get some good quality insight from construction leaders on turning safety into a competitive edge. Firstly, as we all know, yesterday was world day for safety and health at work. So there is no better time to rethink how we approach safety and think of not just the human impact, but the strategic business advantage it can deliver. Yesterday, we put out a survey to thirteen hundred people at EcoInline speaking to frontline workers only in the UK on their safety experiences, their concerns, their worries, and their expectations, but also on the bigger impacts that they have around recruitment, retention, and productivity. Construction often is at the forefront of safety innovations. You just have to look around today in this show, and you can see so many different types of technology from software through to harnesses through to safety handrails to our right that are innovating all the time. Now, the UK work of fertility and monetary impact of lost working time is enormous. The research those people that have researched this panel beforehand, you may have understood that the UK workplace injuries and work related ill health led to an anstonishing two point two million hours of days excuse me, not hours, days lost every year costing the sector around one point four billion pounds. So in times of economic uncertainty, the challenge for construction isn’t whether to invest in safety, it’s more how to make it a critical enabler for performance. Competitive edge is delivered in two folds. The first, we talk about talent acquisition and retention. The new twenty twenty six eco workplace safety report states that an astonishing eighty percent of the UK workforce says the physical safety of work environment is an important factor when they’re choosing an employer. Eighty percent use employment safety to see whether they join. Seventy six percent say that they would not having a good safety culture would lead them to consider changing employer. The second is operation productivity. The two twenty twenty six eco workplace safety states that ninety percent of the workers agreed a safer workplace makes them more productive. In another business leader survey, the vast majority of respondents, again, nine out of ten, expect productivity improvements for more than five percent from moving beyond compliance approach to greater visibility and predictability. Our market has moved over time. Years ago, we looked at compliance, buying health and safety software from compliance. We now if we look into the maturity curve, a lot of companies are now looking at the visibility states, the ability to join data together to be able to spot trends. As you start to spot the trends, you can start to deploy your resources effectively to put to to control any emerging risk. This is going to improve and does productivity by five percent. It makes the workplace safer, enables you to deploy and train your resources in the best possible way. And the third state on that maturity curve is predictability. If you have got software in order to become compliant and you’ve moved to the interconnected data to have visibility of emerging risks, then the predictability piece starts to come from connecting that data with AI. So you can start to have scenario based analysis and probability to say, based on our data, our benchmarking data from the industry, there is an x percentage chance of this event about to happen. The industry that has run this for many, many years is aviation. And as a construction, we are a very, very safe place to work, but we can we can move on that maturity curve from compliance to visibility to then the predictability state. But how do we get there? That’s the big question. So I’m very, very, very lucky to have three experts to come and talk to us. So before I dive in, it’d be great to hear from each one of you who you are, who you work for, and what your role looks like in practice. But before we introduce, it’s not easy to come and sit in front of a whole bunch of strangers, so I’d like you to give everyone a very warm welcome to this session. Steven. Yeah. Hi, everyone. Steven Poxton. I work for Wimbit Construction as a senior IT manager. Key parts of key parts of my role is to work with leadership teams, product product teams to prior to the manage self and self making. Essentially, trying to trying to continually improve is is what we what we’re trying to drive through. We do some really good stuff when we I’ve got this as with every other workplace, there are always improvements which we can make. So we’re always striving towards that with with our teams. So thank you, Stephen, for coming. Thank you. Ashley. Good morning, everyone. So my name is Ashley Manson. I’m the health and safety manager of ReGen Group, which is also part of m group. My day to day changes, to be honest, I never know what I’m doing on a Monday compared to what I’m doing on a Friday. But my role goes beyond the health and safety policy. It can be from strategy delivery. It could be having honest open conversations some of our leadership, with our craft professionals, and then it could be the interest and stuff of boots on the ground doing site visits and inspections. Thanks, Yashley. Pat? Morning, everyone. I’m Pat Sheehan. I’m the associate director of Sheehan from Colas Limited. That is actually me on the picture. I just haven’t had my picture taken for about fifteen years or whatever that was done. ProLast, we’re a highway maintenance, highway construction company, but we also deal with bitumen products and storage of bitumen. So what does my day look like or my week? I deal with I could be on out on-site doing site inspections, safety tours, building reports, talking to the board. So it’s it’s different and it’s different levels in terms of what I do. Thank you, Pat. So we’ll start with a number of questions to get us going. It feels like a quiz. So question one, are you ready contestants? We’re ready. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Alright. Born Born ready. So let’s talk about the programs that you’re putting in place to evolve safety culture for the construction workforce. The question really is, how have that differed to how you were thinking five, ten, fifteen, twenty plus years? And looking at elements of how that’s changed. I’ll start with Pat. Okay. So obviously I’ve been around a long time. Not always in safety, about twenty five years in safety. But when I joined Hollis, I I thought we were quite ahead of the our time in terms of what we did on behavioral safety. But when I look back on it, it was we’ve improved immensely in that time. A lot of that was about we would have safety conversations, we’d get information, but the data was just invisible because you had to take it from a piece of paper, put it onto a spreadsheet, never got to to see it. So it’s moved on now that we we we’ve got more of it. We can see the consequences. We can see what’s happening. We can deal with that trend. So I think we’ve become more intelligent with I know I don’t look intelligent, but the company has become more intelligent in in what we do with that particular information. It’s really interesting you say that, Pat, because when we talked about three maturity states of compliance, visibility then predictability, actually going back to when you started, the compliance piece was paper driven. Right? So today now, as we are walking around this show, there’s AI, there’s software, there it must be really interesting for you to see that that evolving. Yeah. And it’s it’s evolving so quickly at the moment. Yeah. But we we just we had a lot of data that we just couldn’t see in the beginning. That was the problem. Right. So by the time you saw it, too late. Too late. We’ve done. Yeah. Thank you, Pat. Good. I’ll I’ll move on to Steve in this point. Yeah. Of course. So I haven’t been around as long as Pat. No offense, Pat. No. It’s not been twenty five years. I’ve been been a gone to been health and safety for about nine years now. So I’ve said not not that long. I’ve been in comparison to Pat. The difference I’ve seen in that period is quite substantial, to be honest. Back when I first started, it was very compliance driven, paperwork, statistics, data. But what did we actually do with it? I wasn’t at the time. I was at different organizations, but it’s it’s it’s more more centered on processes and things like that. These days, when we’re doing best behavioral safety programs more, I’m doing it right campaign in the last five or six years with with interest initiatives. A couple of examples of that is point of people to work campaign, which was a central round risk assessment. What does that actually look like? You know, how we’re putting people to work, checking the standard of of documentation, but also how was implemented in the real world. Yeah. And really focused on that for a twelve month period and really trying to improve improve that particular element of of the safety management. Secondly, that that’s training from our supervisors. We’ve been trying to put a substantial amount of our supply chain partners with with the blackouts blackouts training with the focus of trying to really get them to understand how important that role is. Yeah. They are the first kind of people seeing the do. And and and the the diet needs to come from there. So I think that’s where we’re the moment for the future. I think I always certainly it’s it’s really well become more part of health and safety management. I don’t think it’ll be a bit all involved. Yeah. But I do believe in certainly assisting in data connection Yeah. Analytics Yeah. And all sorts of things. There’s definitely a theme coming around here. So, Steven, from your perspective, you started in compliance and that was the processes, then you’ve moved to that visibility state. And if we talk about what this speech is about, it’s about competitive safety, competitive advantage, having interconnected data to enable you to do the programs that you’re doing. Right? So, Steven’s gone from a compliance base, a little bit further forward from Pat’s paper base when he started, into looking at visibility that then gives him the ability to then deploy the resources at the right time to then get cracking results. Right? Correct. I mean, your team are in front of us and they’re nodding. They are definitely nodding. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Ashley, the best of last for sure. Oh, obviously. Probably just building on exactly what Steve and Pat have said, rather than looking at the data from the movement of where we are potentially using AI and using that as a competitive advantage. How I’ve seen the industry change in the past ten plus years, what sale been in any longer than that, is probably the reduction and the more holistic approach of what we’re actually doing. We’re getting to the root cause of different elements. So for example, we used to look at health and safety by design, for example. Previously, used to just kinda get on with things, and we used deal with the risk, and we used to think that our control measures were actually sufficient enough. But in reality, we drilled down further, then they weren’t. And it’s very much looking at where we were of let’s just get on with it. It’s what we have to deal with. It’s taken up backwards approach of why don’t we look at the bigger picture here? Why don’t we see how do we impact this potentially five, ten years in the future? So I definitely say from that element, and especially for the health side of health and safety, it used to be that we never spoke about health. It was very much we should shout about safety and we’d whisper health. And we’re very much changing that as an industry, which is really, really good to see. And so it’s very much of where we were ten years ago previous. Now, we’re looking at the future of where we actually want to be in ten years time. So, yeah, it’s really really interesting. In terms of that competitive advantage, we can now see where were we, where are we going now. It’s just taking that more of a flip approach for elimination. I love that. There is another sort of angle to that question as well for for Ashley, if that’s okay. No problem. So you talked about health with a a whisper, but now if we look at the the transition of time, talk to me about psychological safety. Talk to me about gender equality, if that’s possible. Yeah. Have have you seen in that growth? Since I’ve been in the industry, I’ve been in the industry about thirteen years. Definitely, if I had issues previously coming to an unsafe space, It was very much of you want to be physically safe at work. It was don’t want to be harmed at work, don’t want to have an accident or an incident. But it’s very much we’re turning the tables now and we are including that psychological safe space of where were we ten years ago, where are we now. And I think it’s really, really key that we do make sure that that health piece is very much spoken about not just from the harm element, but from that mental element too. Personnel can make sure that when they do come to work, they do have that psychological safe space. They can open up. And then to build on exactly what Steve and Pat were saying, about getting this like key data bit, that rich area that we really want to get into, extract, build, build from. If we don’t have the psychological safe space in the first instance, how are we ever gonna get this magic data that we want to get? So without the reports coming through, we’ll never get the data. We don’t get the data. How do we act on it? So it’s been a big change. Brilliant. I love that. It feels as though we are going on a journey as everybody in this room is going on a journey that we’re leaving every day that we go forward. We’re leaving the health and safety industry in a better place than we picked it up, which is fantastic for everyone involved here. Okay. So that’s that’s where we were, and that’s where we are, and that’s where we’re kinda heading. So, the second question, contestant number two. I’ll start with you, actually. What actually works when it comes to getting workers engaged in safety? In particular, trying to do that at scale. So this is the whole common we have. We have the systems and processes in place. How do we actually get someone like me, Andrew, to actually do it and engage with it? Yeah. So touching on what I just said previous, that psychological safe space. If you don’t feel that you can ‘t have a place in work or you don’t feel that your voice is heard, then where and why are you going to build into this culture? So we speak about health and safety culture the whole time within the industry. Obviously, it’s really really important and it makes us come forth to say I have an issue or I actually have a solution. So health and safety doesn’t always have to be the negative thing. It can be very much a positive thing too if I have a solution. I have the new innovation. I have this AI technology and such like. But it’s very much of why would you why would you not want to come forth? It’s it’s kinda just getting that golden that golden nugget in work of that’s when it works. And you know when it doesn’t work, when we are speaking previously about retention and personnel coming in into the industry in terms of recruitment. You’ve not got the retention, it means obviously your health and safety culture is potentially broken or it’s not working. If you’re not getting talent in, then that obviously means that how the bigger pool is perceiving you is potentially health and safety culture is at a negative impact. So it’s that biggest bigger piece. Rather than just thinking how does it work on-site, it’s taking that backwards approach and thinking, well, do people want to work here? Do people want to stay here? Can I actually entice people to come into my company? It’s having that bigger piece. Naturally, when you have all of them ticked, it will be productivity will be better because you have this open safe space that people can connect, that they can talk to people, they can touch base with senior leaders, they can speak to them, things like that. Pat was speaking about going out on-site visits, site inspections and such like too. When you have them really really great conversations, that’s where people will open up. Love that. Because people will talk about the brand. Right? Yes. And if the brand has a positive culture for safety, then that’s where you want to be going. Right? Not a negative one. So, it’s a huge part of every the ecosystem that we’re working on and there’s some brilliant points there. And Stephen, you brought up some projects that you’ve been working on in order to to drive that operation productivity and improvement. Do you just wanna expand on on those based on the how did you get the workers engaged in that exercise, really? Yeah. So firstly, we I’m trying to proactively manage, which are leading indicators. Our main one being observation reporting tool, which is available via QR codes to people on the shop floor all out to see in mind. Anybody essentially is walking around our contacts has the ability to to report observations. Anonymous there as well, which I think is important. It’s gone back to that psychological safety. It’s been there previously. We’ve we’ve we’ve worked on that. Essentially, need that need that service. We have to report all the bids to report your your issues as well. We’re looking at visible visible leadership, director’s thoughts, things like that coming in as well. Yeah. So talk talk about that. So when we talk about accountability, you’re talking about leadership. So Yeah. Safety from the very top of the business. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. So the leadership leadership tools visible in leadership. You can in a getting those individuals on our projects and then speaking with people undertaking the works. They’re speaking to the project teams as well, understanding that the, you know, the what the barriers what the barriers you guys are experiencing and and really having those open discussions with with those individuals. So on that, I love that. So buying in from the top. Now, Pat, question then. That’s all well and that’s all well and good that the leadership are coming on on-site and they’re and they’re doing the walk around, but who’s training them to make sure that they’re on track, they understand what they’re doing, how they’re gonna do it? And and Pat, how how often do you talk to your leadership in that respect? Mean, I’m quite lucky. I’ve got I’ve got a CEO who’s very proactive on safety. He’s been with the Colas Group longer than I have. And he really leads my example, but we do train all our senior executives and managers. We have a specific course. We run through with people and part of that is about how to engage with people on-site, how to carry out those conversations. Yeah. But a key part of that is that we’ve got to follow through on what we said we’re gonna do. So if we speak to people, we’re gonna put actions in place. We’re gonna make sure we we follow-up. But also talking to people at their level about what’s going on on-site. And I think if you engage with people, talk in a normal conversation rather than spouting three letter acronyms that us and the safety profession love, that makes sense. So you definitely don’t put a QR code on the suit of your CEO as he walks around? No. Right. Just checking. We do have QR codes, but not on the Not on the suit. Okay. Alright. Just wanted to check. Yeah. Because that’s an anonymous report. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So third question. Ashley, I’ll I’ll pick you on there. How have safety and worker engagement translated in better productivity, retention, and recruitment? So you talked about the framework. You talked about hearts and minds, health and safety, but how is that how does that translate into better productivity in your mind? So if you’re happy at work, obviously, you’ll be more productive. You don’t have that horrible Sunday scaries where you’re just like, oh my heavens, I have to go to work on Monday. It’s that element of the translation piece of having better productivity with a happier workforce, happier happier office staff members, happier leadership, and it automatically comes with it. Personnel sometimes focus too much on like lagging indicators, leading indicators, and things like that. And when the focus is too driven down in the wrong potential avenue, then you’ve already lost the battle. You need to potentially extract yourself out and see the bigger picture. Ask the basic questions of when was the last time you spoke to somebody on-site or you spoke to somebody in the office who said, are you happy at work? It’s challenging conversations, again, with psychological safe space that a lot of people don’t want to potentially open up because they don’t feel comfortable. They might not like the response, And and it’s just about being transparent. We’re human beings at the end of the day. The knock on effect it’ll have on being open, being available, and being transparent of potentially having them healthy challenges will have the knock on effects in the industry of, do know what? I had a really really good conversation with Pat or Steve and asked me today if I was happy at work rather than why aren’t you wearing your safety glasses and things like that. It’s just a different approach, that different level. What to translate in the industry to, for example, I’ll be very selfish here at BGen and m group. I wanna work at BGen and I want to work at m group because they challenge me a little bit differently at work. Or they ask me different questions. They make me feel happier at work. They make me feel safe at work. And it’s that element again of productivity will naturally come if you manage to get into these different spaces that people can actually don’t look at. Thank you. So when we talk about visibility of data, this is an interesting one. So we talked about compliance. Everyone needs to be compliant. Everyone understands why. We then talk about the visibility of connecting data together. Happiness as a as a connection would be linking to things like how many times are people off work, how many times yeah. That type of data would give you those leading indicators to that. Yeah. Definitely. Like you touched on earlier, in terms of the days lost, such like, has a massive impact on the industry. Yeah. Let alone human beings in general. We know it’s two point two million days lost last year. Yeah. Yeah. Lovely. Thank you, Ashley. So this one might be useful for everybody to have a think about, really. The question is more about we talked about, again, the compliance state, then the visibility state, and Steven talks about key KPIs and leading indicators. So we’re all here to reduce risk and stop bad things happening to both people and the planet, both from a physical safety, but also mental health as well. But which leading indicators prove the most useful in helping you spot and reduce the risks before a potential incident would happen? And have a think about it amongst yourselves as well of what KPIs are you using that really are making a massive impact. So I’ll start with Pat on this one. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. No problem. So obviously you’ve got the near miss reports, you’ve got the safety inspections, the safety conversations where you’re getting a lot of trend data because your lagging indicators could be showing everything’s rosy and then when you actually start looking behind the scenes, it’s not so good. But there are other things that we’ve got, vehicle telematics. There’s also got AI enabled cameras that are facing, so dash cams facing out, facing in. We’ve got huge amounts of data from that and it’s also got in vehicle coaching to remind the driver of what they should be doing. We’ve seen a huge improvement in terms of reducing speeding, reducing people inattentive driving, not having their seat belts on, not fitting their digital tacos, all of those. And by having that leading indicators, you can just focus on it because sometimes people just need a reminder because they forget. Yeah. So it’s it’s not just about hitting them with a big stick and discipline and and getting rid of people, It’s just a bit of reeducation. And let’s be honest, if we all drive, we’ve all maybe crept over the speed limit because we’re not paying full attention. So if you just let people know there’s consequence to it, that they’ve got to improve, then those indicators can help them. I love that. You’ve got you’ve got technology that enables you to, in essence, be able to spot any incident that’s about to happen and Yeah. Do in coach, cab, if you like, training. I I’ve had one of them for twenty six years. My wife has been very confident of that with me the whole time. So I don’t think it’s new, Pat, to be honest with you. Yeah. But if you then take that technology, how do you then link it to the visibility of all the health and safety that you’re running? That’s one very specific element. Yeah. So let’s talk about that vehicle telematics. Great data, great information, limited visibility within the company. So what we did, we actually used Eco online. We had got an API. It didn’t pay me for that, by the way. That’s just the reality of it. Sorry. What was the product, sir? It was Eco Online. Dot. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Thank you. So we created a well, you created rather an API. Oh, wasn’t Because Eco Online has got fantastic visibility in the company. We use the dashboards at weekly, monthly meetings, and that data was then brought forward. And I’ll tell you what, when it comes forward in front of senior management, it does drive performance. I love that. Yeah. Thank you for sharing that, Pat. Steven? Yeah. So I’ve touched on that. That was our sales programs. So I want want to delve into that. Well, we our instant reporting, general inspections, your general stuff where you will identify new issues that need to be resolved. Setting actions that we’ve seen through the workflow. Again, we’re we’re all users of info exchange, which is an you go online products. We absolutely love that. Fantastic. We have on our browse pages for our incidents and German inspections. For example, we have we have we have graphs, charts, and things like that, which is which is visible to all users of the system. Project managers, people are dealing with all the leadership and also other new controls. And that is taken to the internal agents as well in regular meetings. Another thing I want to touch on going to the technology side of it is we’re open to all our new company in Nocturne, which is our software. Whereas, kind of an avatar speaking, it’s more than England. It’s here to do away with the the the issues of language barriers. Yeah. We have a lot of it’s a very multicultural workforce and construction. So I’ve opened that up and and, you know, I’ve given inductions in people’s native tongue. It was a it’s it’s only it’s only gonna be an improvement. It’s just like a. The future really has arrived, hasn’t it? Yeah. I’ve just got an avatar with a a Dudley accent training me as though I’m being inducted. I love that. That’s fantastic. Yeah. Brilliant. Okay. So let’s move on to question number five. So when we look at the connected safety tools and systems, especially around AI powered ones that give you the complete view of operation risk and site performance, where is that visibility coming from? We know that we bring it in reports. We’ve talked about feeling. We’ve talked about checking in. If we talk about the AI linking into into Pat, but where where where where is the complete view coming to? Your senior leaders are getting fed data and reports all the time, but where is it how are you delivering that message in a clear and concise process? There are lots of different ways of consuming data. What is working well? And I’ll start with Pat on that. What’s working well to to get that message across? Do know what? We we put something into the last ops ops com meeting, and it was just a simple table, and all I put was a green thumbs up or a red thumbs down on all the indicators that led into the main KPI. Whether that was the telematics, whether it was the number of trackers as though in terms of manual handling track, all of those particular elements. And it was just like how many greens, how many reds. And that really hit home just by a simple visual. So visual is works great because it’s people will see it clearly. Just a debate. Yes. But isn’t there gray in green, orange, red? I just did red and green. So it was either good or it wasn’t. So there was no I didn’t do any in betweens. Okay. There may be over time Yeah. We might get into that stage, but at the moment, we’re either doing really well or we’re failing miserably. So maybe it’s us. Yeah. You know. Ashley, thank you, Pat. Yeah. Ashley, from a design phase, what are you thinking about how that reporting is is gonna be taken at the end of that phase? Yeah. So, looking at it from a health and safety by design element is when you can see that perfect golden spread from concept to project delivery of it being live, commissioned, or potentially going through its entire life cycle of potentially being demolished, to be honest. And you know that AI has given you that competitive advantage, just touching back on AI, of when you’re not doing things in silo anymore. It’s not just the health and safety function speaking to itself entirely. It’s the finance team coming on board. It’s the commercial team coming on board. We’re very, very difficult to work with sometimes as professionals because it’s our data, this is our lead in, this is our lagging indicators. To be able to use AI to its competitive advantage is being able to have them key touch points so you’re no longer working in silo operations. Yeah. You can openly share this data. It’s available for everybody. And for them to be able to use it to their advantage as well, so not just taking advantage for your own department. It’s what’s greater impact in terms of the health and safety element. What’s greater impact for financial? What’s the greatest impact on the program when we’re looking at operational delivery and things like that too? So if I build a have that holistic approach, again, how can we actually use this to our advantage? Well, I can bring Pat on this journey with me. I can bring Steve on this journey with me. Do you know what? Can bring HR on this journey with me. It’s just not keeping it to yourself anymore. That’s the first question that we had this morning was very much of where have we been in last ten years? It was, I was Ashley Lansing, I was all by myself, and I would never dream of sharing information with Pat, for example, because I thought that’s keeping me in a job. In reality, if you go to, bucket and l, this is psychological safe space, I want to work with Ashley because she shares her data, she shares insights with me, and that’s how we need to make sure that we’re using this competitive advantage of just sharing the information. I love I absolutely love that because you’re absolutely right. I mean, the speed of change now on data, we all know that the information around safety is in hidden in data. We all know that if we if we all set up a company tomorrow, we wouldn’t go and buy seventeen different systems that don’t integrate with each other, build out departments that don’t talk to each other to then have that visibility. We wouldn’t do that. Right? We would try and buy one system that gave us complete visibility. I always ask that question of the NHS. Why isn’t there just one system across the whole NHS for every single hospital? And and that’s just the way that humans are, I suppose. But a little bit of audience participation, and before I get to Steven, can I just ask a raise of hands of how many of you are using AI right now to give you that visibility of KRIs across data, across multiple teams? One, two, three, four, five, six. So I would say that’s probably about five percent. Okay. Another question. And by the way, this is just for participation, not not for research so much, but how many of you actually trust AI or could or are concerned about the data accuracy of AI? So everyone trusts AI’s data? No. Okay. It’s the other way around. Okay. Yeah. And I think that’s the half of the battle now. So isn’t it interesting that we’re going through that entire maturity curve where we now have the tools in place, but we’re not actually sure whether that data is correct. And I will just jump into a a technology change that that Pat actually brought up. Right? So all those years ago, there was a massive technology change that happened to every single one of us in the room. And it was called four g. Four g suddenly appeared out Nowhere you might remember there was loads of contracts, loads of people bidding for this four g contract. And because of the technology of four g, we had the ability to put satnav in our car. You might remember, we stuck it on the windscreen, and it was called TomTom or or whatever it was, Garmin. Right? And back then, the human was being led by technology. And there were so many examples of people driving down the wrong way over one way because Sat Nav told them to do it. There were so many people that end I think that there’s one that ended up in a river. Right? I think that was quite famous. They went into a river. And so suddenly the human didn’t trust what was going on until the technology got better and better and better, and then it now gets integrated into your car as standard. You probably don’t even know who manufactures your sat nav in your car if you have one. And then it gets even worse that today, I can track my children walking home from school to walking through the front door within, like, a two a two meter radius. It’s quite incredible. But that’s the that’s an example of how we’ve evolved in probably what? Sat Nav now? Ten years probably? To trust that technology. And now, if I want to meet someone, if I was to say, Pat, should we meet, I don’t know, in a in a pub in London? I wouldn’t try and lock on an NAP to find that pub. Excuse me. I’d just go on Google Maps and take take the the phone would take me there. Chances of my phone being taken out of my hand on the way in London, probably quite high, but, you know, it got there anyway. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I just wanted to put that point out there. Pat, you’re on telly. Okay. So one of the big the big bits, right, and just to round this off a little bit more, is we’ve talked about how the industry has changed and how everyone here has has had a massive impact in making this a better place to work, both from a safety but also psychology and health landscape. We’ve talked about initiatives. We talked about compliance moving to visibility for data to then put into programs to then get real productivity and operational excellence. We’ve talked about senior leadership buy in. We’ve talked about rolling out programs, and and we’ve talked about thinking about the outcome before we start the program itself. And it’s been a fantastic journey at the NEC to talk about that. But there is the one big question that I think that probably rounds this all off. Is that all great, but your financial directors are sat there with objectives in a company where one of the primary objectives could be profit to the stakeholders. Right? Which means the CFO will be sat there, and he and she will be being given projects and projects and projects to make decisions based on where to allocate budget for the best bang for the best part. Now, we’ve talked about productivity. We’ve talked about operational excellence. But actually, in practical matters, how do you continue to get the commercial value of leadership and the board of business to fund the fantastic work that you’re doing and more into the future? And I will start with Pat on this. Yeah. Okay. So I’ve already mentioned how lucky I am with the CEO. I’ve got I’ve mentioned it twice now because I forgot to turn up to a one to one with him this morning, so I’m hoping he’ll see this. So if anyone’s looking for a Yeah. But I do actually so what I would do is I would approach him because if if I convince him it’s the correct thing to do or what the advantage are and what benefits we’ll get, it will go through. I mean, we haven’t got unlimited money. We’re like every other company. We we do have to get the right amount of payback from that investment. But but by having that credibility of going through various things, introducing them, they’ve worked well, you build up that trust and we’ve got a good we haven’t worked together that long, but we’ve got a good level of trust. Perfect. So, Pat, we are going for building rapport with the chief executive to ensure that he buys into your mission and understands the value you’re getting. Very quickly, same question. Yeah. Absolutely. Very very similar to Bartoway. We’ve got a lot of you. When Rick’s when Rick’s saying that he is a very, very onboard with the HFCU. And any any of we have, we’re potentially wanting to bring into the business. We have a lot discussion with them. Yep. And then, you know, point forward and it is considered. We have we we have given us significant projects as well to to have for HCP and to what the business operates up to purchase this on. Does everyone agree with those comments? There’s not? Yeah. So please don’t tell me that you can’t get budget next time we ask for a for budget because, Pat, you’ve obviously nailed your CEO for that money. So thank you very much. That’s very nice. So Ashley, the final words, if you don’t mind. No problem. If you were to talk to your up and coming generation, what would what bit of advice in a minute would you give them? I’d probably say just be your authentic self Don’t ever turn into that person that has Sunday scaries and you worry about work on Monday. Be happy in what you do. I’d probably just say be yourself. I know it sounds really, really cringey, but for you to be able to deliver yourself successfully at work, if you’re attempting to be somebody else, it’s going to be such more of a sworn. We spend a lot of time in work. We spend a lot of time in our careers, and it’s just about making sure that you enjoy the journey along the way. I’m definitely gonna finish the panel based on that positive note. you very much.